With more than $160 billion in assets under management, the State of Wisconsin Investment Board (SWIB) is one of the largest public pension funds in the U.S. Nearly 700,000 beneficiaries depend on SWIB for their retirement needs, and playing a key role in ensuring those benefits are there is Anne-Marie Fink. The Yale and Columbia graduate is the chief investment officer of Private Markets and Funds Alpha at SWIB, joining in 2020.

Fink spoke with us about her views on the market, the shifting landscape in private markets, and some of the biggest challenges she faces in her role, among other topics. 

How did you get started in the industry?

After I finished business school I got a job as a buy-side equity analyst at JPMorgan. I really loved the role because it was so multi-faceted – a great combination of quantitative and qualitative work. I also loved thinking about businesses and what makes them tick, and in that role you have access to some of the smartest people around. After JPMorgan I spent time as the chief investment officer for the Employees’ Retirement System of Rhode Island and as a portfolio strategist at State Street Global Advisors.

What is your overall view of the current market environment?

There are a lot of things we need to think about right now. Geopolitics and some of the changes in the world order that we’ve seen are certainly making for challenging times. Another challenge is that valuations appear high and markets are concentrated, which is an interesting phenomenon. In general, I think approaching the market with a healthy bit of caution is smart, but you still want to be involved. 

Can you talk about some of the changing dynamics you’ve seen in private markets of late? 

There are a lot of different threads here. Privates have certain advantages over publics, and I think one of the biggest is governance. Private equity funds can see all their companies’ information in a way public shareholders can’t, and they can work much more closely with management teams in a way public shareholders can’t. The market structure of public markets has changed a lot over the past 30 years or so; public investors used to hold positions much longer. Private equity also gets to control their exits. The primary disadvantage of privates is clearly liquidity. As an owner, the flip side of the GP being able to decide when to sell is that I don’t get to decide. There’s also the concern about interim marks. Generally, I’m less worried than the biggest skeptics about marks, but I am a little concerned about how retail investors are getting involved in what has traditionally been an institutional market. Too much capital chasing too few opportunities is never good. 

How do you view investing from an active vs. passive perspective?

It really depends on the staff and the talent you have. Active is really hard, and you need to devote a lot of resources to manager selection in order to have success there. We had a small staff in Rhode Island, so we went passive with much of the assets and we prioritized where we thought we had the best odds of outperforming with an active approach. We were active with our alts and most of our fixed income, and the bulk of our long-only equity we invested passively. At SWIB I have a much bigger staff so we can be active across the full spectrum because we have the capabilities and resources to tackle the efforts required to succeed.  

Have your views on emerging markets changed since the U.S. actions in Venezuela?  

I mentioned earlier how geopolitics is becoming a bigger issue and I think we’re just seeing a lot more unpredictability across the board. And not just as it relates to emerging markets. There is a lot of uncertainty everywhere, and the way we’re dealing with that is with a combination of diversification and having a substantial amount of our assets with managers who can be very nimble. We can’t predict everything that is going to happen, but we can engage with managers who can respond quickly as things change.  

Diversity within the ranks of asset management is an important consideration at PGIM, and throughout the industry overall. Can you offer your views on the role diversity plays in your business?

I think diversity of life experiences and diversity of views are really important in evaluating investments. Not long ago we hired someone on our real estate team who came from a different geographic location than most of the team, and we found some investments that we probably would not have found without his different experience. That’s just one example. We all have our blind spots, and it’s not just race or gender, but having different ways of looking at things.  

What is the biggest challenge in your role?

Markets are always changing but it really does feel like a lot is changing now. In the grand scheme of history, I don’t how different things are, but in the past 30 years or so it feels like the pace of change has accelerated. Technology is advancing rapidly and we need to make sure we appropriately take advantage of the tools that are literally evolving every day. And finally, I have a team of 30 professionals who work with me, and I need to make sure they feel motivated and secure enough to take appropriate and thoughtful risks while being mindful of those risks.  

What do you like to do to unwind outside of the office?

I love to travel. I just got back from Morocco, and it was awesome. I’m also a big reader.